Space & Astronomy/Space and Astronomy (October 1993).iso/mac/TEXT/SPACEDIG/V10_1/V10_110.TXT

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Subject: SPACE Digest V10 #110

SPACE Digest                                     Volume 10 : Issue 110

Today's Topics:
           Dan Quayle, news media, toxicity
           Earth microorganisms on Jupiter.
          Re: Toxic materials on the Shuttle
Re: Radioactivity vs Chemical toxins (Was Toxic materials on shuttle)
             Re: More linguistic tidbits
       Re: YAHSS (Yet Another Henry Spencer Signature)
               Re: Flame On!!!
        Re: X-30, Space Station Strangles NASP
           NASA Prediction Bulletin Format
           Earth microorganisms on Jupiter.
           Earth microorganisms on Jupiter.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:         Sat, 30 Sep 89 13:35:07 EDT
From: Kenneth Ng <[e-mail]>
Subject:      Dan Quayle, news media, toxicity


:Date: 20 Sep 89 20:36:23 GMT
:From: hercules!joyce!apptek11![e-mail]  (Alan Algustyniak)
:Subject: Re: Edgar Rice Quayle on Mars.
:
:In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Kelton Flinn) writes:
(edited out Dan Quayle's comments on Mars having an atmosphere)
:I saw it too, and had the same reaction.  I remember, tho, that the narrator
:said:
:    "Most scientists believe that Mars doesn't *have* an atmosphere!"
:            --CNN News narrator trying to stick it to D. Quale
(edited out another CNN goof)
:    "learn how the planets affect the weather."
:
:            --CNN Newsreader explaining science to his listeners
:I called CNN about the pieces.  I could feel the blank stare the woman
:the listening must have had on her face.   W.r.t. the last piece, I tried
:to get thru to her by emphasizing "Only an *astrologer* would say that
:planets affect the weather."  Her reply?
:        "No, you mean *astronomer* !"
:
:It's hard to get anywhere when the inmates are running the asylum.
:    Alan

After trying many times, I am thoroughly convinced that for the most
part news organizations are more interested in selling papers than
the truth.  Granted this does not pertain much to Space, so I'll keep
it short.

Several years ago an exclusive report by ABC Channel 7 in NYC said
that the dangerous radon buildup in Montclair New Jersey was due
to illegally dumped nuclear waste buried underground.  After calling
ABC for close to two hours, I got an editor (forgot his name) that
said "We have confirmed the story with numerous sources".  The real
source of the radon was that it occurs naturally in certain rocks.

The New York Times Science Times quotes the Cold Fusion people as
saying that they know fusion is occuring because they detect tritium
and tritium does not exist in nature.  Last time I checked it does
exist.  The editors never answered my letter explaining the correction.

The President's Commission on the Accident at Three Mile Island had
a lot of recommendations for power plant design, government, industry,
etc., and the news media report most of that.  What the news media
did not report, however, was the section on the news media hiring
some real exports on nuclear energy and doing some more factual
reporting.

Then there is plutonium, so called deadliest substance known to
man kind (well, this is a bit related to space).  I've heard this
title attributed to plutonium, dioxin, botulism(sp), and some of
my cooking :-).  Does anyone have or know of a list that has the
most deadly substances known sorted by amount and intake method?
(ie ingestion, inhalation, etc).  Obviously they all can't be
the most deadly substance, I think.

Kenneth Ng - TEIES Project.
NJIT - CCCC
Newark New Jersey

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Sep 89 12:04 CST
From: "I did not commit any crime." <[e-mail]>
Subject: Earth microorganisms on Jupiter.

I feel that thinking that Earth micro-organisms are somehow "hardier" than
Jupiter's (if existant) is a very egotistical thought.  As far as I can
recall, all of the instances on Earth where "imported" micro-organisms
"took over" (say Hawaii, for instance), the place they were imported to
was a very small, fairly stable ecosystem, and the imports were from large,
diverse systems.  It could be argued that the Jupiterian environment
is larger, and more diverse to boot :-)

(Thought: this is similar to the expectation by most Americans that wherever
they go, they'll be able to speak English, and be understood.  Unfortunately,
it seems to work :-)

Scott

------------------------------

Date: 30 Sep 89 03:01:49 GMT
From: gem.mps.ohio-state.edu!wuarchive!mailrus!jarvis.csri.toronto.edu!utgpu!utzoo![e-mail]  (Henry Spencer)
Subject: Re: Toxic materials on the Shuttle

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Christian Reimer) writes:
>  The point you are missing is that while the shuttle's beryllium will only
>become a health hazard if it is vaporized/powdered and dispersed (so that it
>can get *inside* an organism), plutonium can and will pose a threat to public
>health even if it is dispersed in large chunks...

Please cite numbers for this, remembering that Pu-238 is an alpha emitter
which produces very little penetrating radioactivity.  In any case, even
with the much nastier Pu-239, the stuff is just not all that dangerous
unless it is finely divided and dispersed.  Nobody is worrying about
having to sweep up a few dangerous lumps; it's the remote prospect of
finely-divided dust dispersing on the wind that bothers them.  There are
plenty of things on the shuttle that are dangerous in lumps, starting
with tons of hydrazine (that stuff is *vile*, being toxic and carcinogenic
in addition to flammable, volatile, corrosive, and explosive; its main
saving grace is that once it vaporizes and the cloud disperses, it's gone).
Plutonium's radioactivity is an *advantage* if you're talking about large
chunks, because it makes it very easy to find.
--
"Where is D.D. Harriman now,   |     Henry Spencer at U of Toronto Zoology
when we really *need* him?"    | uunet!attcan!utzoo!henry [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 30 Sep 89 06:07:02 GMT
From: well![e-mail]  (Jef Poskanzer)
Subject: Re: Radioactivity vs Chemical toxins (Was Toxic materials on shuttle)

In the referenced message, [e-mail] (Rick Francis Golembiewski) wrote:
}Also radition is dangerous in that it can't be easily detected

I'd say a $2.00 film badge qualifies as "easy".  And for localizing hazards,
you can get nice portable counters for a couple of hundred bucks.  What are
the equivalent cheap and general detector for chemical toxins?  I'll give
you a hint: there aren't any.

Now, GET THIS SHIT OUT OF SCI.SPACE!
---
Jef

    Jef Poskanzer  [e-mail]  {ucbvax, apple, hplabs}!well!pokey
"Every time Europe looks across the Atlantic to see the Americans, it observes
               only the rear end of an ostrich." -- H. G. Wells

------------------------------

Date: 30 Sep 89 01:50:04 GMT
From: asuvax!motpe![e-mail]  (Michael Collins)
Subject: Re: More linguistic tidbits

In article <[e-mail]6> [e-mail] writes:
>
>   So far I have seen Venerean,  Venereal and even Cytherean, but what ever
>happened to Venusian?
>
>John Coughlin    Net: [e-mail]   Vox: 613-541-6439   Fax: [phone]

Asimov did an essay about this quite a number of years ago in "Fantasy
and Science Fiction".  It was reprinted in one of the Discus Books
anthologies.  Don't rememeber the name of the article or the anthology
(though it's in my collection at home if anyone is REAL worried about
this sort of thing).  His conclusion -- Venerean is the correct term.
Venusian is definitely wrong (and, of course, most commonly used),
though I don't recall the specifics.  I'll take Isaac's word.

Michael P. Collins                  | [e-mail]
Motorola Microcomputer Division     |
Tempe, AZ                           |

------------------------------

Date: 30 Sep 89 11:44:46 GMT
From: datapg!com50!questar![e-mail]  (Al Viall)
Subject: Re: YAHSS (Yet Another Henry Spencer Signature)

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Peter Scott) writes:
> jarvis.csri.toronto.edu!utgpu!utzoo![e-mail]  (Henry Spencer) writes:
>
> >"Where is D.D. Harriman now
> >when we really *need* him?"
>
> Hmm... has anyone tried pitching the commercial space program to Donald Trump?
> I was just in Manhattan and visited Trump Tower.  It's obvious the guy isn't
> afraid to spend money...  ah, I can see it now... the *real* "Trump Shuttle"...
>
> Peter Scott ([e-mail])

Funny as it is, I had the same thought awhile back. I figured that there are
enough billionaires in the world vain enough to see thier names emblazoned
across the heavens that a space station could be up and running in no time.
Of course, we'd have to call it 'TRUMP STATION'.
Later, we could all watch shuttles race around the moon in the 'MOON d' TRUMP'.

Albert Viall

--
  | INTERNET: [e-mail]  |  FLASH: "Dan Quayle's face    |
  |     UUCP: ..!amdahl!tcnet!questar!al | seen on Mars" It Looks Puzzled|
  |   "Uhh, Excuse me while I take a moment to adjust my tribble."       |
  ------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: 29 Sep 89 14:29:59 GMT
From: hpfcso!hpldola!hpctdlb!hpctdls![e-mail]  (Richard Katz)
Subject: Re: Flame On!!!


-/hpctdls:sci.space/ [e-mail](Andy Edeburn) /9:59 am  Sep 28, 1989 /
-
-Alright, let's get a few things straight out there.

- ...

-(2.) Fears of Infecting the Jovian System.

-   How many of you people claim to be scientists? How many of you took
-basic college biology or microbiology courses? Wake up! Most bacteria
-or viruses do not survive in temperatures above 130 degress Celsius or
-below -50 degrees Celsius. Seeing how temperatures in the vacuum go
-farther beyond either of these two extremes, your fears of microbial
-infection at Jupiter seem pretty ridiculous, don't you think?

Really.  Now where do you get your data that inside the probe, the
area people are concerned about, vary in temperature from below -50C
to above +130C.  Generally, spacecraft are kept at a fairly
comfortable temperature.  Before making this statement why don't you
get some real data or specifications on this system?

Secondly, if you want to 'prove' that some people's fears about
infection at Jupiter are pretty ridiculous, you should not use terms
such as "MOST bacteria or viruses".  Saying that things are PROBABLY
ok isn't a good way to go about things, if you feel that the risks of
being wrong are important.  We've all seen what happens with this kind
of mentality.  If you don't feel that "infecting" Jupiter is important
then fine, that's your opinion.

- Think before you post!!!

Good plan.

-+--------------------------------------------------------------------+
-| Andy Edeburn  {CC62@SDSUMUS}       | "It is always better to trust |
-| Computing Center & Data Processing |   your dog, rather than your  |
-| South Dakota State University      |     neighbors." - Walton      |
-+--------------------------------------------------------------------+

rich k.

------------------------------

Date: 30 Sep 89 22:00:55 GMT
From: mailrus!jarvis.csri.toronto.edu!utgpu!utzoo![e-mail]  (Henry Spencer)
Subject: Re: X-30, Space Station Strangles NASP

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Eugene Miya) writes:
>Yeah, I think Henry and I agree on this one.  We need more X-30
>type programs.  And its not clear what kinds of directions are needed.
>We sort of got side tracked from the X-15/X-20 lines of doing things....
>There's a lot of research required for sustained hypersonic flight.

Actually, I was thinking of space launchers in general rather than
hypersonic flight in particular -- I'm actually not convinced that
hypersonic flight is the way to go for cheap spaceflight -- but the
point still holds:  too many ideas with potentially large payoffs
are languishing on the ground instead of being tested in flight.
--
"Where is D.D. Harriman now,   |     Henry Spencer at U of Toronto Zoology
when we really *need* him?"    | uunet!attcan!utzoo!henry [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 1 Oct 89 00:15:52 GMT
From: ncis.tis.llnl.gov!blackbird![e-mail]  (TS Kelso)
Subject: NASA Prediction Bulletin Format


As a service to the satellite user community, the following description
of the NASA Prediction Bulletin's two-line orbital element set format is
uploaded to sci.space on a monthly basis.  The most current orbital elements
from the NASA Prediction Bulletins are carried on the Celestial RCP/M, (513)
427-0674, and are updated several times weekly.  Documentation and tracking
software are also available on this system.  The Celestial RCP/M may be
accessed 24 hours/day at 300, 1200, or 2400 baud using 8 data bits, 1 stop
bit, no parity.

==============================================================================

Data for each satellite consists of three lines in the following format:

AAAAAAAAAAA
1 NNNNNU NNNNNAAA NNNNN.NNNNNNNN +.NNNNNNNN +NNNNN-N +NNNNN-N N NNNNN
2 NNNNN NNN.NNNN NNN.NNNN NNNNNNN NNN.NNNN NNN.NNNN NN.NNNNNNNNNNNNNN

Line 1 is a eleven-character name.

Lines 2 and 3 are the standard Two-Line Orbital Element Set Format identical
to that used by NASA and NORAD.  The format description is:

Line 2
Column     Description
 01-01     Line Number of Element Data
 03-07     Satellite Number
 10-11     International Designator (Last two digits of launch year)
 12-14     International Designator (Launch number of the year)
 15-17     International Designator (Piece of launch)
 19-20     Epoch Year (Last two digits of year)
 21-32     Epoch (Julian Day and fractional portion of the day)
 34-43     First Time Derivative of the Mean Motion
        or Ballistic Coefficient (Depending on ephemeris type)
 45-52     Second Time Derivative of Mean Motion (decimal point assumed;
           blank if N/A)
 54-61     BSTAR drag term if GP4 general perturbation theory was used.
           Otherwise, radiation pressure coefficient.  (Decimal point assumed)
 63-63     Ephemeris type
 65-68     Element number
 69-69     Check Sum (Modulo 10)
           (Letters, blanks, periods = 0; minus sign = 1; plus sign = 2)

Line 3
Column     Description
 01-01     Line Number of Element Data
 03-07     Satellite Number
 09-16     Inclination [Degrees]
 18-25     Right Ascension of the Ascending Node [Degrees]
 27-33     Eccentricity (decimal point assumed)
 35-42     Argument of Perigee [Degrees]
 44-51     Mean Anomaly [Degrees]
 53-63     Mean Motion [Revs per day]
 64-68     Revolution number at epoch [Revs]
 69-69     Check Sum (Modulo 10)

All other columns are blank or fixed.

Example:

NOAA 6
1 11416U          86 50.28438588 0.00000140           67960-4 0  5293
2 11416  98.5105  69.3305 0012788  63.2828 296.9658 14.24899292346978

Note that the International Designator fields are usually blank, as issued in
the NASA Prediction Bulletins.

--
Dr TS Kelso                           Asst Professor of Space Operations
[e-mail]          Air Force Institute of Technology

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Sep 89 12:04 CST
From: "I did not commit any crime." <[e-mail]>
Subject: Earth microorganisms on Jupiter.

I feel that thinking that Earth micro-organisms are somehow "hardier" than
Jupiter's (if existant) is a very egotistical thought.  As far as I can
recall, all of the instances on Earth where "imported" micro-organisms
"took over" (say Hawaii, for instance), the place they were imported to
was a very small, fairly stable ecosystem, and the imports were from large,
diverse systems.  It could be argued that the Jupiterian environment
is larger, and more diverse to boot :-)

(Thought: this is similar to the expectation by most Americans that wherever
they go, they'll be able to speak English, and be understood.  Unfortunately,
it seems to work :-)

Scott

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 28 Sep 89 12:04 CST
From: "I did not commit any crime." <[e-mail]>
Subject: Earth microorganisms on Jupiter.

I feel that thinking that Earth micro-organisms are somehow "hardier" than
Jupiter's (if existant) is a very egotistical thought.  As far as I can
recall, all of the instances on Earth where "imported" micro-organisms
"took over" (say Hawaii, for instance), the place they were imported to
was a very small, fairly stable ecosystem, and the imports were from large,
diverse systems.  It could be argued that the Jupiterian environment
is larger, and more diverse to boot :-)

(Thought: this is similar to the expectation by most Americans that wherever
they go, they'll be able to speak English, and be understood.  Unfortunately,
it seems to work :-)

Scott

------------------------------

End of SPACE Digest V10 #110
*******************